tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post2499045091837519766..comments2024-02-28T22:24:07.299-08:00Comments on Community Forum for HCC (APP) in Seattle Schools: First day of schoolAndrew Siegelhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06830585083467140758noreply@blogger.comBlogger125125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-84353164828853720772012-09-14T22:12:37.495-07:002012-09-14T22:12:37.495-07:00To Another Hims parent - I just dont understand wh...To Another Hims parent - I just dont understand why the reluctance to state teacher names on the blog. These same few names have been noted many times in posts last year on this blog. I'm truly not trying to be snarky, but why exactly is that unethical? I think it does add value to the post, in fact this is exactly the kind of info that parents want (at least I do): who are the teachers that have been noted, again and again, as problem or weak teachers? When my child comes home complaining about curriculum or unprofessional behavior, is that an anomaly or has this been going on for years with that teacher? Should I be documenting the teacher's behavior in writing because history shows the teacher is not open to change or communication, and I may need that documentation down the road? I think we are all trying to advocate for our child, but also to strengthen the program along the way, if possible. Once you get one kid through 3 years of Hamilton, you know. I thought this blog was about sharing information and opinions among APP parents, I'm not tweeting this info all over the internet. I don't think I'm saying anything horrible, perhaps I should add IMO (and the opinion of many other parents) - these have been noted as weak teachers. And on the extremely unlikely case that one of those teachers reads this blog or hears about it - GREAT! Maybe they'll think twice before humiliating a student; making completely inappropriate comments to the class; or perhaps just put a dash more effort into the lesson plans. I understand what your saying, but I respectfully disagree. I will also qualify and say - YMMV with these teachers - maybe your child will have a great year but if you are the type of parent who wants to know which teachers in the program have been noted as weak for various reasons - well youve probably already heard this from other parents, so again I dont think its particularly shocking or revealing to note these teachers names.<br />- HIMS parentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-6667335597550992192012-09-14T16:44:10.560-07:002012-09-14T16:44:10.560-07:00- 6th and 8th grade HIMS parent
While I totally ag...- 6th and 8th grade HIMS parent<br />While I totally agree with you on this:<br />"But at the very least I think we shoudl try to set a higher bar for professional behavor from the teachers."<br /><br />I would like to ask you please don't post teachers' name here. It is not ethical, and doesn't add value to your post.<br />-Another 6th and 8th grade HIMS parentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-27026612167664773082012-09-14T09:00:46.781-07:002012-09-14T09:00:46.781-07:006th and 8th grade HIMS parent,
Agree. Also would...6th and 8th grade HIMS parent,<br /><br />Agree. Also would add.... to set a higher bar on behavior of parents and kids as well.<br /><br />High expectations + tempered reality (win some, lose some) = better sleep at night<br /><br />-duckAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-34752602552192591562012-09-13T16:28:01.147-07:002012-09-13T16:28:01.147-07:00There have been many official complaints about Thu...There have been many official complaints about Thurik (6th g Math), Chacon (6th gr LA/SS), various 7th gr APP LA/SS teachers that are no longer teaching that subject, and the 8th gr science teacher Veit. Maybe other teachers as well that I dont know about. Definitely complaints about non-APP teachers as well. All centering on the lack of professionalism of these teachers (as noted in comments above) as well as the material and the way its (not) taught. Complaints to the teacher and then to Mr Carter, from us and several other parents i know of. He didnt do anything about it, perhaps he had too much going on or else knew he was leaving? Now we have a new principal and she seems pretty pro-active, so I suggest new parents give it a few weeks and see how it goes. If you have specific concerns, discuss with the teacher. If that is not effective, DO let the principal know - ideally in writing. We may get more results with this principal. I think venting here or advising to just live with it because your child will be fine - none of that is effective in changing the status quo. You should advocate for your student but you do need to look at the big picture - there are some really good teachers at HIMS and some awful ones, and you have to pick your battles. From what I'm hearing, this is the case at most SPS Middle Schools including WMS, so.....not sure what our reasonable expectations can be. But at the very least I think we shoudl try to set a higher bar for professional behavor from the teachers. <br />- 6th and 8th grade HIMS parentparentnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-43633057362366731452012-09-13T15:00:33.927-07:002012-09-13T15:00:33.927-07:00We have come to an agree to disagree end here.
I...We have come to an agree to disagree end here. <br /><br />I think it's very helpful to read others' experiences on this blog, but I want to read both good and bad experiences. <br /><br />I don't want someone to "tall me" how to solve the problems. I wondered, from your perspective, how one is to do that since bad teachers are just part of middle school. Maybe that's my answer - you don't try and solve it, you just deal. If it doesn't kill you, it makes you stronger. I disagree with that 100%.<br /><br />I still adamantly refuse to believe that having an incompetent teacher in a classroom is okay and that we as parents are impotent. There is a valuable lesson for kids seeing their parents work to create change and to not just put up with whatever they are given.<br /><br />Nothing gets changed if everyone pretends that nothing is wrong.<br /><br />-can't wait to be as smrt as youAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-25516782032640189402012-09-13T14:27:03.756-07:002012-09-13T14:27:03.756-07:00can't wait to be as smart as you -
I can'...can't wait to be as smart as you - <br /><br />I can't control whether you find my perspective helpful. My guess is - some will and some won't. <br /><br />Sounds like you only want to hear from people that agree with your perspective and tell you how to solve the problem.<br /><br />Your assumptions that we didn't deal with negative situations when they occurred is wrong. We did - within our family and with communication with the teacher(s) when we felt it necessary. Sometimes it made a difference - sometimes it didn't but our child learned a ton along the way.<br /><br />I can't help you solve a perceived, untenable problem (horrible Middle-school APP program) that I don't see in the same way based on my "older, and more worldly" perspective.<br /><br />Best of luck.<br /><br />-Garfield APP ParentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-18818486339642347162012-09-13T14:03:38.403-07:002012-09-13T14:03:38.403-07:00Been There
"This teacher even sent a note hom...Been There<br />"This teacher even sent a note home that my child posted on the wall."<br />I would prefer to hear these lines about any math teacher: she/he gave math lessons in an exciting way that the students learned the basic concepts really well and could use them later to solve different problems themselves (with no or only little help). She/he gave the necessary (different) amount of repetition and time to learn the concepts but then she/he gave challenging, mind bending problems that the students could think about for a couple days and then later could debate on how to solve them and which was the best tactic/strategy to reach the result. The students were happy to go to her/his class and eager to learn math. These are advanced students in middle school we are talking about here.<br />-Different expectations<br /> Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-64495098056032762522012-09-13T13:46:11.265-07:002012-09-13T13:46:11.265-07:00There is a way to offer advice that is helpful and...There is a way to offer advice that is helpful and there is a way that is not. Telling parents that it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things is not helpful. It is a problem now. That you chose to deal with it differently (or not at all in order to teach "resilience") is up to you. <br /><br />I do appreciate the benefits of the APP program. My child had a very good elementary APP education. That makes the Hamilton situation all the worse. <br /><br />No one has still explained what are parents to do? Do all you older, more worldly parents really think sitting back and doing nothing is the way to get the program improved in middle school? <br /><br />-can't wait to be as smrt as youAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-27164683849285477072012-09-13T12:33:43.553-07:002012-09-13T12:33:43.553-07:00oh yeah-
Just to be clear - my 6th grader was &qu...oh yeah-<br /><br />Just to be clear - my 6th grader was "precious". Incredibly smart, precocious, a love of learning, inquisitive, still gave me hugs everyday.<br /><br />The teenage years have dulled that a bit - as they get ready to leave the house and they begin to distance themselves from you and make their own decisions re: most aspects of their lives. As it should be.<br /><br />Our hope is that they will come back to us for hugs, advice, and perspective once they leave for college - or at least that's what our friends with kids in college say.<br /><br />-GHS APP ParentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-89355813723525437992012-09-13T12:27:09.162-07:002012-09-13T12:27:09.162-07:00-can't wait to be smart as you
Sorry if saw m...-can't wait to be smart as you<br /><br />Sorry if saw my post as patronizing -- I said that I felt the same way you do when my kid was in 6th grade.<br /><br />If you don't want perspective from someone who has had a similar experience but now has a different perspective - then that is up to you.<br /><br />I was just trying to say that when you look back at a situation a few years removed, you realize that the learning and growth that happened as a result (for the child) was positive or not necessarily as high stakes as it may seem at the time.<br /><br />I'm glad for what my kids experienced in middle school (as I said - warts and all) because it has made them much more able to navigate the perils and pitfalls of high school on their own.<br /><br />-GHS APP Parent<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-24881961770088058162012-09-13T12:17:34.012-07:002012-09-13T12:17:34.012-07:00We shrill, overreactive 6th grade parents probably...We shrill, overreactive 6th grade parents probably can learn something from listening to parents that have gone before. At least I can see that there might be some truth to what they are saying, or at least will open my mind to the possibility, rather than shutting them down. Why so snarky on this site? Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-36618567864114048972012-09-13T11:46:58.130-07:002012-09-13T11:46:58.130-07:00Is it only me, but I find it very confusing that o...Is it only me, but I find it very confusing that on this thread there are multiple people (I found at least 3-4 "been there" with only a slight different writing) posting under the same nick.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-16094501852544755622012-09-13T11:41:44.850-07:002012-09-13T11:41:44.850-07:00Been There -
Can you reveal the gender of your ch...Been There -<br /><br />Can you reveal the gender of your child who had a great experience with this teacher?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-80121972814266013952012-09-13T11:37:02.534-07:002012-09-13T11:37:02.534-07:00GHS parent-
When I am as old and wise as you are,...GHS parent-<br /><br />When I am as old and wise as you are, can you teach me to be equally patronizing?<br /><br />-can't wait to be as smrt as you<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-10048622365531491842012-09-13T11:36:13.977-07:002012-09-13T11:36:13.977-07:00Had nothing to do with my thinking my student was ...Had nothing to do with my thinking my student was "precious."<br /><br />The teacher lied to me about what was going on in the class, made up stories about my student, undermined my efforts to help my student.<br /><br />So sorry if I don't turn a blind eye to a bad classroom situation; if voicing my concerns makes me a shrill, hypercritical parent - so be it.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-74864471596394268372012-09-13T11:34:55.917-07:002012-09-13T11:34:55.917-07:00I have two kids out of high school and one in high...I have two kids out of high school and one in high school now. I've always felt the greatest benefit of APP in terms of actual support to the student's unusual developmental needs was in elementary school, with middle school being far less consistent and high school being almost irrelevant. The IBX program may change my mind about that.<br /><br />I also think that middle school is often a very unhappy and difficult stage in one's education for various reasons, which may or may not be personal. But bureaucracy, bad curriculum, stupid policies, and the occasional incompetent teacher sure as heck don't help.<br /><br />Helen Schinskehschinskehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10316478950862562594noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-31883471087906109402012-09-13T10:18:52.126-07:002012-09-13T10:18:52.126-07:00Anonymous and Been There -
Agree 1000% with you -...Anonymous and Been There -<br /><br />Agree 1000% with you -- as a parent of older APP kids - what happened in 6th grade means less than nothing to our high school kids and didn't ruin the rest of their academic career.<br /><br />You can't tell that to someone that hasn't experienced that yet though -- 6th grade parents are still in the "my precious" stage (I was there too!) - so until their kids get older and they see the benefits of the APP program (warts and all) moving into high school - they will continue to vex about what they perceive as a horrible situation.<br /><br />Growing pains (for parents and kids)<br /><br />-GHS APP ParentAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-89124601743862505432012-09-13T09:32:51.544-07:002012-09-13T09:32:51.544-07:00In some cases, students did try to self-advocate, ...In some cases, students did try to self-advocate, and were ignored/mistreated/belittled by the teacher. At a certain point, parents do need to step in.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-5977544072553722212012-09-13T09:31:37.416-07:002012-09-13T09:31:37.416-07:00We are supposed to put up with a bad teacher to te...We are supposed to put up with a bad teacher to teach our kids "resilience?" My goodness. I would prefer to NOT teach my kid to be a doormat.<br /><br />My child deserves a good year of math education and that is what they are getting - outside of school.<br /><br />It is far easier to teach your kid "resilience" by leaving them in a poor classroom environment. It is much harder to be proactive and actually do something about it. It is also a much more valuable lesson for a kid.<br /><br />-not gonna do itAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-91340218240446550812012-09-13T09:15:07.149-07:002012-09-13T09:15:07.149-07:00Been There: I agree with you. As a parent of older...Been There: I agree with you. As a parent of older APP kids, I shudder when I read some of the comments here; it's what gives APP parents a bad rep: shrill, hypercritical, feeling like everyone is getting a better deal than their kids. You know what? WMS and HIMS both have bad 6th grade math, but it gets better in 7th and 8th. North and South have split and it's messy and uneven and there's no going back to when "everyone was together". This is about your kids, not you. Life is messy and often disappointing. But there's lots of good, too, and your ms kids will be better served in the long run if you'd model self-advocacy and action, combined with appreciating what IS good, rather than endless complaining about how "bad" their school/teacher is. Teach them resiliency and self-direction, not impotence and riteousness.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-35671301581713372062012-09-13T07:37:25.283-07:002012-09-13T07:37:25.283-07:00From my understanding, some of the teacher complai...From my understanding, some of the teacher complaints are around treatment of students. Belittling students, and being "tough" in a way that seems intent on breaking the child down, rather than supporting their learning. Yes, each year will have its challenges and it won't always be a good fit, but there should be a baseline expection of teacher competence and professional behavior, which hasn't been met by some teachers. A student can only do so much when there are no books to fall back on. It isn't just a matter of a teacher going too slow or too fast.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-6724519914003030022012-09-12T23:03:53.769-07:002012-09-12T23:03:53.769-07:00I have a 7th grader who took APP math from a certa...I have a 7th grader who took APP math from a certain named teacher last year. My child learned a lot and did fine. Please give this teacher a chance. This teacher even sent a note home that my child posted on the wall. I have told my kids that THEY are responsible for their learning, and that each year one (or more) teachers will bore them or go too slow (or fast). Nonetheless they have the responsibility to get all they can out of the class. I'd like to respectfully request first that individual teacher names not be used, and second that people give the year a chance to get underway before making judgments. You will especially do your kids a favor not to talk about your reservations about certain teachers with them.<br /><br />Been ThereAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-82479328677850323302012-09-12T15:56:21.823-07:002012-09-12T15:56:21.823-07:00Just wanted to add that well before the split ther...Just wanted to add that well before the split there were more northern APP families, by a long shot, and particularly NE families. So, it does make sense that there may be more posts from that geographic area. Being sensitive to different points of view is just as valid here as it is with other school concerns that touch on diversity. Having more perspectives creates a richness to APP discussions, let's not lose track of the benefits of taking care of everyone's needs. Thank you Greg for running this blog for the whole program, it is a great vehicle for bridging the divides.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-54918011009865535502012-09-12T13:41:46.209-07:002012-09-12T13:41:46.209-07:00Hi Curious,
I don't think the APP north-south ...Hi Curious,<br />I don't think the APP north-south split for elementary and middle school have had only negative repercussions. There was a sadness to the split of the families that had had such cohesive community. I can only speak as a northeast person---it seems more north families chose to take part in APP once the split happened. New friendships developed. There were some losses, but not everything was bad. My child is now a 9th grader and was therefore in the first middle school north south split class three years ago in 6th grade. They thought they would all see their elementary friends in 9th grade at Garfield. It seems a lot of the north students chose Ingraham IBX over Garfield. Some, especially those with older siblings who had attended Garfield, chose Garfield. Also, those students who were very interested in AP or music. I would say that the decision process was very very difficult for all involved last year during open enrollment when students had to "opt out" of Garfield in order to choose Ingraham.NESeattleMomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14685367298254415469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-49477819860064489942012-09-12T10:51:47.957-07:002012-09-12T10:51:47.957-07:00Reading here, it seems that the K-8 APP splits hav...Reading here, it seems that the K-8 APP splits have had only negative repercussions. Is that true? And what about the 9-12 split? (AP classes at GHS vs. IBx at IHS) Has that had any negative effects? It doesn't seem to be an issue on this site. Maybe because families can choose between the two programs?<br /><br />CuriousAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com