tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post3516885964216752517..comments2024-02-28T22:24:07.299-08:00Comments on Community Forum for HCC (APP) in Seattle Schools: Garfield Honors For All FAQAndrew Siegelhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06830585083467140758noreply@blogger.comBlogger134125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-47322869536259517822016-07-21T00:36:40.201-07:002016-07-21T00:36:40.201-07:00and hence the uproar to howard's comments in t...<br /><br />and hence the uproar to howard's comments in the st. chip, chip, chipping away. oh well.<br /><br /><br />no caps. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-32642607578490429592016-07-20T18:53:16.966-07:002016-07-20T18:53:16.966-07:00I will add that at least in middle school students...I will add that at least in middle school students have more flexibility in taking online courses (or summer courses) without the school having to approve coursework. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-63937517167062262802016-07-20T18:48:10.238-07:002016-07-20T18:48:10.238-07:00MW, for years, individual schools have been doing ...MW, for years, individual schools have been doing what they want in terms of AL program delivery - maybe they are just now acknowledging the anything goes standard as standard. It would not surprise me if the Honors for All for LA/SS soon extends to middle school HCC (it makes scheduling so much easier). Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-39040633438571513562016-07-20T16:58:16.579-07:002016-07-20T16:58:16.579-07:00I had a good talk today with Wyeth Jessee (and I h...I had a good talk today with Wyeth Jessee (and I hope to do a write-up at my blog in the next 24 hours.)<br /><br />I have to be honest; I don't see good things for HCC and Advanced Learning. There is definitely something happened at SPS around how they are now going to view education and it's basically thru a Gen Ed lens with "supports" for other students (depending on needs.) <br /><br />There also seems to be this kind of new set-up so that the schools can make their own decisions (seemingly without having to tell the district - that I don't get at all) and overall district mandates (but those seem few and vague.) <br /><br />Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-2330007303040127362016-07-19T21:18:34.519-07:002016-07-19T21:18:34.519-07:00Huh?Huh?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-3792489390392506892016-07-19T20:46:00.212-07:002016-07-19T20:46:00.212-07:00I think the kids who really need a remedial class ...I think the kids who really need a remedial class may be getting an even worse deal than the kids who need an honors class here. Using up their elective course space by making them take two LA classes is pretty crappy.<br /><br />Helen Schinskehschinskehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10316478950862562594noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-47915954372593218602016-07-19T17:15:29.395-07:002016-07-19T17:15:29.395-07:00"Detracking requires a sense of mission groun..."Detracking requires a sense of mission grounded in the belief that public schools are democratic institutions dedicated to the success of all students, not just the academic elite." So says the Carol Burris book cited by the GHS questionnaire. There's a good societal argument for this point of view, despite the clear negative impacts to HCC students (including my two). It's clear from the June Seattle Times article what GHS's priorities are, and optimizing in any way for HCC students isn't one of them.ByeByeSPSnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-57314056066799074322016-07-19T04:52:59.558-07:002016-07-19T04:52:59.558-07:00https://www.commonsensemedia.org/book-reviews/the-...https://www.commonsensemedia.org/book-reviews/the-absolutely-true-diary-of-a-part-time-indian#<br /><br />Agree - Common Sense Media suggests appropriate for ages 14+.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-11646661020322597042016-07-18T22:10:58.910-07:002016-07-18T22:10:58.910-07:00I'm going to point out that lexile levels are ...I'm going to point out that lexile levels are not really that awesome a judge of literature where language, theme and style don't neatly conform to computer algorithms. "Grapes of Wrath" also has an equivalent low lexile level but it doesn't mean its not appropriate for High School.<br /><br />The Absolutely True Diary of a Part-Time Indian won all of the following after it was published:<br /><br />2007 National Book Award for Young People's Literature[14]<br />2008 American Indian Youth Literature Awards. American Indian Library Association Best Young Adult Book.[15]<br />2008 Boston Globe-Horn Book Award, Fiction and Poetry[16]<br />2009 Odyssey Award as the year's "best audiobook for children or young adults", read by Alexie (Frederick, MD: Recorded Books, LLC, 2008, ISBN 1-4361-2490-5).[17]<br />2010 California Young Reader Medal, Young Adult Book (eligible to win once during its first four years)[18]<br />The Diary was also named to several annual lists including three by the library industry.<br /><br />"Best Books of 2007", School Library Journal[19]<br />2008 "Top Ten Best Books for Young Adults", Young Adult Library Services Association (YALSA)[20]<br />Benjamin Leishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10974191081762367425noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-51247136189592969342016-07-18T21:52:03.859-07:002016-07-18T21:52:03.859-07:00The Absolutely True Diary is written at a fourth g...The Absolutely True Diary is written at a fourth grade reading level. Awesome.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-72840605698034255452016-07-18T13:27:24.757-07:002016-07-18T13:27:24.757-07:00Texts are generally taken from the approved high s...Texts are generally taken from the approved high school LA list, yes? The 2015-16 GHS course catalog lists <i>Absolutely True Diary of a Part-Time Indian, American-Born Chinese</i>, Homer's <i>Odyssey</i>, and <i>Romeo and Juliet</i> as anchor texts for both honors and non-honors 9th. Additional texts are not listed.<br /><br /><a href="http://www.seattleschools.org/UserFiles/Servers/Server_543/File/Migration/Departments/Curriculum/laaim.pdf" rel="nofollow">SPS LA 9-11 approved instructional materials</a>Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-5120931389932156682016-07-18T11:56:13.130-07:002016-07-18T11:56:13.130-07:00@ CapHill Mom, according to the GHS catalog, the a...@ CapHill Mom, according to the GHS catalog, the anchor texts for the classes were the same all along--it was the nature of the work they did based on those texts that was different. There may also have been additional texts required in the honors classes, I don't know. <br /><br />As Advanced Learning and C&I staff have said all along, the texts themselves aren't an indication of rigor. For example, you can read the same book in middle school, high school and college and do a lot of different things with it. Someone can write a PhD dissertation on a book students typically read in middle school. The level of analysis required and the accompanying written expectations should be what make it an honors level vs. a standard level 9th grade class. Which begs the question--will some kids get easy assignments and others hard assignments in this new Honors for All class? Will that be determined by track history, test scores, race, or ? If assignments are differentiated by level of complexity, does the honors designation really indicate that the class was an above-grade-level class? It would be interesting to see a side-by-side comparison of the learning objectives and expectations for the previous honors vs. regular versions of both classes. That would be important in demonstrating a maintenance of rigor, but as yet teachers haven't shared it.<br /><br />Also note that the Garfield catalog also says that Honors LA 9 has an expectation of 5 hrs of homework per week, whereas homework for the regular LA9 class "varies." Will students forced into the Honors for All class now be expected to do 5 hrs per week of LA homework, plus whatever additional homework requirements there are for SS Honors? Or will they lighten the homework requirements for everyone, without watering down the course?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-84422679712225973412016-07-17T16:58:48.490-07:002016-07-17T16:58:48.490-07:00Can anyone provide information on the reading list...Can anyone provide information on the reading list for the previous 9th grade honors English at GHS and has anyone said if that will be consistent for this year's "honors for all" class? That's one starting point to assess if the school plans to maintain the level of challenge. CapHill Momnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-49683488566718226862016-07-17T13:23:14.411-07:002016-07-17T13:23:14.411-07:00Melissa, sorry to be so late in responding. Very b...Melissa, sorry to be so late in responding. Very busy work week. Sure majority of states mandate support for gifted programs. The problem is they don't support the rhetoric with dollars. So in actual classrooms, that's not what students find. Look at breakdown of state funding amount and consider that funding is used for AP/IB programs, ACT/SAT testings, support dual enrollment (i.e. running start). Having these programs and testing meet the requirement of serving the gifted. This also means richer school districts can afford money for gifted learning by making up for what the state doesn't cover. Poor districts and rural ones can't. It's a huge gap.<br /><br />https://www.nagc.org/resources-publications/gifted-state/2014-2015-state-states-gifted-education<br /><br />Areas of concern listed by the latest report are very telling: 1) national mandate, 2) funding (interestingly respondents rate funding for basic education as pressing and in need of attention), 3)a huge sea change- inclusion of underrepresented groups (rural, ELL, SPED, low SES, ethnicity, etc). <br /><br />treading water Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-29176817427098916242016-07-17T10:27:22.056-07:002016-07-17T10:27:22.056-07:00If nothing else, the survey and list of references...If nothing else, the survey and list of references gives one a clearer idea of the pedagogy and priorities driving instructional practice. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-67390124388036836922016-07-17T08:33:09.739-07:002016-07-17T08:33:09.739-07:00Which skills, other than those typically associate...Which skills, other than those typically associated with reading and writing and learning about history, do you believe are most important for students' future success?<br /><br />1) Effective planning and organization so important information is communicated to involved parties in a responsible manner and plans and follow-through are optimally carried out, 2) A strong ethic of truthfulness and integrity in all dealings with others to foster trust and willing partnerships<br /><br />Applies to both teenagers and adults.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-14637912689642821392016-07-16T16:21:06.579-07:002016-07-16T16:21:06.579-07:00Read the GHS survey. A bit push poll.
What's...Read the GHS survey. A bit push poll. <br /><br />What's left out of the choices for "What do you believe differentiates an honors class from a regular education class? Choose all that apply." is concerning.<br /><br />-More reading<br />-More writing<br />-More homework<br />-Faster pace<br />-Coverage of more material<br />-Higher level thinking<br />-Other<br /><br />What about increased complexity? Advanced level readings? The next question asks you to select the most important component (choose one from the list above).Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-82949308707771149062016-07-16T15:11:35.141-07:002016-07-16T15:11:35.141-07:00Regarding the use of local norms, probably there s...Regarding the use of local norms, probably there should be some type of balance. But if the argument is that the HCC kids are so off the scale they need something different, well that's really a relative measure best compared to their local school.<br /><br />If one looks at the tests, as I noted above, the difference between scoring in the "HC" range and the "Average" range is primarily a factor of what a student has learned by a given point in time, not that they necessarily learn differently. Even average kids may learn differently. And in first grade it can be less than 6 months difference.<br /><br />So a child that went to several years of preschool where they teach "pre-math" and "pre-reading" as well as science and geography and french and music and what not at $15,000+ a year is certainly more likely to be "ahead". And if they go to a top rated elementary school with other similar children as compared to a poorly rated school, with their parents continuing to pay for out of school enrichment activities, then they are likely to get even further ahead.<br /><br />I don't consider this the fault of the "white" parents and I don't believe it makes them racist. I certainly want the best for my kids and don't think it makes a lot of sense putting kids that are so different by 9th grade in the same class. But I do think the current system overlooks some kids who could be high achievers and I would have no problem at all if they used local norms early on because the difference in first and second graders is going to be a lot smaller than the different in 9th graders.<br /><br />I'm very skeptical that by simply testing more kids using a screener its going to make much difference.ne dadnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-20205951284434358102016-07-16T12:41:44.695-07:002016-07-16T12:41:44.695-07:00Regarding Burris's school one CANNOT compare G...Regarding Burris's school one CANNOT compare Garfield to South Side in Rockville center or compare resources in the districts. My cousin sends her kids to school in Rockville center. I am from LI. The school has a very low free & reduced lunch (10%) and is very affluent. I would not even state it is middle class, upper middle & affluent kids. Lakeside comes to mind as the best comparison. The school district (like many on LI) is small, only one high school for example. Class sizes are literally half Seattle class sizes. Her kids have 17-22 in their high school classes PLUS they have instructional assistants. Property taxes for her 2200 square foot house are $16000 per year, majority goes toward school taxes. There is also a state income tax in NY state. In contrast to Garfield, their honors classes previously were not opt in. Garfield allows kids to choose between honors & general ed. Standford research indicates class is the main factor in the achievement gap, not race. Standford Research indicates the achievement gap between blacks and whites has narrowed greatly past 30-50 years, while between classes has doubled in the past 30-50 years. Research indicates income inequality is the main issue causing the gap and African Americans are over represented in lower socio classes.<br /><br />http://www.nytimes.com/2015/09/23/business/economy/education-gap-between-rich-and-poor-is-growing-wider.html?_r=0<br />- Theresa Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-87878142447047635062016-07-16T11:12:04.969-07:002016-07-16T11:12:04.969-07:002 Updates:
1. I added a link to the official Garf...2 Updates:<br /><br />1. I added a link to the official Garfield Website which has a survey you can participate in.<br />2. I've also started to track articles as I see them on a permanent page on the right. There is no claim to completeness yet.Benjamin Leishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10974191081762367425noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-43160010718248153842016-07-15T16:26:43.629-07:002016-07-15T16:26:43.629-07:00I think there is value to local norms, but I also ...I think there is value to local norms, but I also know that my HCC kid was a wreck socially at our neighborhood school, which is one that sends a lot of kids to HCC. A lot! <br /><br />But even with large numbers of other high scoring/high achieving kids there, my own kid didn't flourish and find a "tribe" until going to Lowell. The year we switched, so did 8 or 9 other kids in that grade, but because they were spread out over 4-5 classes (with only one other qualified kid in my kid's K class and one other in the first grade class), my kid struggled mightily to make friends. <br /><br />Maybe if they'd done the Brulles ability grouping, we'd have had much better K-1 experiences? I don't know. I just know that Lowell was practically a life saver for our kid after two very tough years emotionally and socially. And of course, I have no idea if that kid would have qualified under some sort of local norms rule, it's all hypothetical. But I guess my point is that coming from a school with lots of HCC-qualified kids doesn't mean that it's okay to leave them all there. Sometimes you need regular interaction with an even bigger cohort, at least at a young age when learning how to fit in.<br /><br />Who Knows?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-84196008688518828032016-07-15T16:18:53.973-07:002016-07-15T16:18:53.973-07:00"Offering gifted program in school districts ..."Offering gifted program in school districts is still a rarity and is the exception in the US."<br /><br /> From National Association for Gifted Children:<br /><br />"Thirty-two states reported on programs or services required for specific categories of giftedness and talent. Most of these states required services for intellectual giftedness (22) and/or gifts and talents in academic areas both general (17) and specific (16). Nine states reported that programs or services were not required.<br /><br />Twenty-two respondents were able to estimate the most frequently used delivery methods for upper elementary, or grades 4-6. Cluster classrooms (17), resource rooms (15), subject acceleration (12), and self-contained classrooms (11) were the top delivery models.<br /><br />Several states have statewide public high schools for advanced math and science and/or arts and the humanities. Although the admissions requirements vary, these high schools are typically residential schools for juniors and seniors from within the state; most of the schools are located on university campuses."<br /><br />Not such a rarity and this bears out my own research, especially in urban and suburban areas. <br /><br />As for the question of charter schools, there are indeed high schools that are very rigorous (see BASIS in Arizona.) I have no doubt our region will see these come in. <br /><br /><br />Melissa Westbrookhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17179994245880629080noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-20273798091349583952016-07-15T14:47:25.184-07:002016-07-15T14:47:25.184-07:00The use of local norms is supported by the CogAT a...The use of local norms is supported by the CogAT author, Professor David F. Lohman, and it makes sense.<br /><br />Do people really believe it’s equitable to use the same norms for HCC selection for a school with 15% qualifying versus a school with <1% qualifying? <br /><br />In other words, it’s equitable to qualify 4 kids out of the same kindergarten class in a school rated among the top five in a state (the case for our child), and then turn around and say that a kid that might have scored 50% above every other child in her class for the last three years is not qualified even though they attend one of the lowest performing schools in the state.<br /><br />In first grade, a Fall MAP Reading score of 181 is in the 95th percentile. The same 181 score is only in the 79th percentile using the winter norms. In the second grade, a 202 is in the 95th percentile using the fall norms, and in the 89th percentile using the winter norms. With just 4 months of additional reading instruction, a child can go from being “general education” to “highly capable”. <br /><br />A child that has received multiple years of high quality child care (or pre-k) who then attends a top elementary school with many parent volunteers and veteran teachers is far more likely to qualify for HCC than a child who never went to pre-k and who attends a poor performing school with high teacher turnover, no matter how hard the student tries, how "bright" they are, and how well they do.<br /><br />In fact I would argue that we need the HCC program far more for the kids in the lowest performing schools than in the highest performing schools because its potentially one of the only chances those kids have. But we need to give them a fair chance to qualify.<br /><br />https://faculty.education.uiowa.edu/docs/default-source/dlohman/best-practices-in-using-standardized-tests-for-talent-identification.pdf?sfvrsn=0<br /><br />ne dadnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-55460710774634826752016-07-15T13:25:36.222-07:002016-07-15T13:25:36.222-07:00Just a comment for the parent who is trying to mov...Just a comment for the parent who is trying to move their incoming ninth grader out of Garfield. If you would prefer your neighborhood school, it might work to withdraw your child from the district and re-enroll in August or early September. <br /><br />For the future, I wonder how much interest there would be in a charter school that's designed to serve advanced students from grades 6-12. My youngest child will likely go private for those years but not having to pay for it would be a relief.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4649338642905686469.post-15136414740869764462016-07-15T13:22:04.026-07:002016-07-15T13:22:04.026-07:00Use of local norms as part of composite scores is ...Use of local norms as part of composite scores is Best Practice for Lohman:<br /><br />http://www.wku.edu/gifted/project_gems/objective1.phpAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com